aquagon wrote:That comes from the fact that various of the songs don't have an actual Hymn Crystal for them (such as Chronicle Key, Suspend, Sublimation, among others) and the information we got from the translation for the Infel Phira download spell, which can be used to download an Hymn Crystal into a Reyvateil, the feelings of a song from a Reyvateil to an Hymn Crystal, and the feelings of a song from a Reyvateil to other.
Thanks, interesting inferation
I though it was in the materials explicitely somewhere, thanks to your use of the term "inverse-download"
I presume there would be an "upload" spell of some form which could be used this way.
Although, as I understand it, it's not simply a case of creating a new hymn in your mind that lets it become an Extract (eg, something that might require a Hymn Code to download); it usually also needs to be programmed into the Tower/Song Server systems in some way in advance (usually during their design, but sometimes later), and then when the Hymn is sung, it orchestrates an already-existing program. Although I think there are some Hymns (eg: Phantasmagoria), which aren't explicitely pre-programmed this way (as far as we are aware), but which do still have some kind of effect on the Tower/Song Server systems.
aquagon wrote:Yes, it comes from the book, and there are also other forms in there that didn't appear in the game (described, but not pictured).
I'm looking forwards to reading more about those when you translate those sections at some point
exec_rainichan wrote::3 Ah Shuny, you made the perfect thread. I have a good list of questions already~
Welcome to the thread
And by the way, most of your questions aren't answered directly by the official materials (that I'm aware of), but I'll try to suggest a few theories regardless.
exec_rainichan wrote:When Hibernation was sung, what would the effects have been in Sol Ciel, if any (reverse Suspend)?
Probably not immediately, since Sol Ciel isn't dependent on Metafalss. There might even have been a short-term benefit to Sol Ciel, if Sol Marta was no longer drawing power from Ar tonelico.
exec_rainichan wrote:Would Shurelia have seen something Not Right going on in her tower since the song would have passed through the first tower?
Well, the canon material is a bit confusing on this point.
Based on various descriptions in the At2 timeline, it seems that Sol Marta was intended as an independant Song Server:wiki/index.php/Settei_book_2_translation/History_section#Sol_Marta_Elevates_to_the_Skies_.283033.7E3040.29
And that it's main problem (why it acts like a relay), is because it wasn't completed and doesn't have a way of generating it's own Symphonic Power, so it relies on the first Tower for that: wiki/index.php/Settei_book_2_translation/History_section#Sol_Marta_Elevates_to_the_Skies_.283033.7E3040.29
Given the above, it seems like Sol Marta executes songs directly, and just draws power (at some constant rate) from the first Tower.
But most other descriptions and tables seem to indicate that Sol Marta acts purely as a relay (with the possible exception of hosting Frelia's Binary Field), and that all the song magic (that doesn't get executed by Infel Phira), is directly executed by the First Tower.
Unfortunately, there isn't much in the way of "technical specs" on Sol Marta itself, that I'm aware of. But based on the various descriptions, I think that most likely Sol Marta is purely a relay (besides hosting Frelia's Binary Field), but it would have been a fully-fledged independant song server, if it had been completed.
But even given the above... As far as I am aware, Shurelia isn't aware of the details of the various Hymns or Songs being executed by her Tower. It probably (for her) takes place on an unconscious level. Otherwise, imagine how chaotic it would have been for her in the First Era, when the Tower's capabilities were used to their maximum capabilities (eg: during war with Sol Cluster), or if the Tower is executing the maximum possible number of songs (10 million
There's also the fact that the Tower was heavily damaged during the Grathnode Inferia, and now relies on the Silver Horn, which complicates things a bit
exec_rainichan wrote:What about when Luca started to sing Hibernation, or any false starts for the song? Would they have been seen/heard/felt in the tower?
Most likely not, for the reasons described above.
exec_rainichan wrote:Since Sublimation was a worldwide event, it would have effected Sol Ciel and Sol Cluster as well, correct?
Correct, everyone on the planet (souls and bodies) would have been absorbed into Infel Phira at that point (and possibly also the planet Ar Ciel itself):http://artonelico.wikia.com/wiki/Hymmno ... ANATION.2F
.http://artonelico.wikia.com/wiki/Hymmno ... ublimation
exec_rainichan wrote:Do Reyvateils get sick? I imagine 3rd-generation would since they're born of humans and Reyvateils (from what I understand), but would it be conventional sickness, or some other virus? What about Beta-types and Origins?
Most likely yes, since Reyvateils are biological and have very similar bodies to humans (remember, humans and RTs can have children together. Does pregnancy count as an infection?
), even if they're created artificially. Although I'd imagine that RTs might have some slightly different symptoms or illnesses to humans, given the unique structure of their bodies.
Beta-types might (theoretically) have a greater resistance to some illnesses, thanks to their D Cellophanes, which regulate their bodies growth.
Origins too, might be further resistant, thanks to their Tower/Song Server maintaining their bodies.
About viruses, I don't think that RTs are susceptible to those most of the time, thanks to their Boundary Gate and other security features. When it does happen, it's usually thanks some very advanced hacking, as seen in the games.
exec_rainichan wrote:Would those in Sol Ciel and Sol Cluster know of the legends of Rhaplanca, or is that a Metafalss-only legend?
I know next to nothing about the legends myself, but judging by a few things I've found on various forums (eg this
), it's probably a Metafalss-only legend. Although Sol Ciel might have learned of those legends when they obtained the Metafalss Note (as described in the At2 history on the wiki, here
And by the way, I also found this download link for an interesting-sounding mp3 http://download555.mediafire.com/oz9zjh ... planca.mp3
(Thanks to Lazy for uploading this a while back on the old forum).
exec_rainichan wrote:What happens to the towers if the Origins are harmed? Example: Shurelia gets heavily electrocuted during battle, would that happen to the tower as well seeing as how she's connected to it?
I think it depends on the Origin, and their relationship with their Tower/Song Server.
For Shurelia, probably no direct effect, given that several things happen to Shurelia in At1 without affecting the Tower. I think it's more of a one-way relationship for her (damage to the Tower makes her feel pain, as described in the At1 timeline, here
). There's also the fact that the Tower has basically been been offline since the Grathnode Inferia, although it does still maintain many functions.
For Frelia, if she was hurt badly, it might interfere with her "Song", and cause damage to Metafalss and her Tower, given that she supports them directly with her power.
exec_rainichan wrote:Along with the previous question, can Origins be killed? I know that as long as the towers exist, the Origins will live, but if they're stabbed through the heart or have some other normally fatal blow dealt to them, do they die? If they die, what would happen to the towers?
Yes, I'm pretty sure they can be killed. They may be immortal (as in never aging) thanks to their Towers, but they can be hurt, just like any other Reyvateil (eg: Shurelia being hurt in battle in At1). I think the Tower acts more like a Nuclear Triangular Loop which never runs out, unlike the one found in Betas.
And of course, there's also the "Linker" Hymn, that was created for the purpose of allowing another Reyvateil to replace the Origin: http://artonelico.wikia.com/wiki/Hymmno ... KER.2F..29
As for the Towers:
- Shurelia's Tower might go inactive if she were killed, because it relies on her Binary Field for it's operation. And also, because an Origin is a required element for the first Tower to operate (as it's "brain", basically), according to the At1 history.
- Frelia's Tower would probably disappear, and also the Rim would plunge into the Sea of Death, if Frelia was killed.
exec_rainichan wrote:If Origins can create Binary Field stories, could they recreate or mimic an actual Cosmosphere?
Well, they could probably simulate one, but it wouldn't be an actual reflection of their subconscious, that Vanguards could interact with to resolve her psychological issues and make her stronger spiritually.
exec_rainichan wrote:If a vanguard or protector wanted to know more about the Origin Reyvateils, could they mimic or create a "mind guardian" (obviously not a real one) and a "cosmosphere" like other Reyvateils have?
I guess the Origin, or someone very familiar with the Origin's inner mind might be able to make some kind of simulation. But it wouldn't be actual diving into the Origin's subconcious, as you see with Third Gens and Betas.
exec_rainichan wrote:They can create characters and a game world, so would it be possible for that too?
I think that's more of a pre-programmed script, like playing a video game or reading a book, rather than an actual adventure through the Origin's literal subconscious mind.
Although it might be possible one day to Dive Origins, if Dive Machine technology were advanced enough (or if their Binary Field was changed in some ways), given that it might be even be (theoretically) possible to Dive humans, who don't even have a Cosmosphere:http://artonelico.wikia.com/wiki/Wave_T ... nto_Humans
But either case (diving humans, or diving Origins in the way you describe), would most likely require some major advances in Wave Theory, and it might even be found to be impossible at that stage.