Progress report

[Kari]

Continued from here

Updates of progress on the project go here.

[fetjuel]

Hiii! I'm chipping away at Cloche's Cosmosphere over here. Things are going well, but slowly because of work.

I created a page at the wiki to keep track of the status of all the different sections, so we can be sure what is done and what needs to be done next. If anything is wrong or if I'm missing something you did (I only included the translation parts), please update it!

http://at2.limitedwish.railsplayground. ... jectStatus

[Kensou77]

i don't think i'll be able to work at least until i know if i pass or failed the term... and the courses basically... and things aren't exactly looking up...


i'm glad fetjuel's back though ^.^

[Kensou77]

how is the project going?.. i haven't had anything to report on my end, my exam is tuesday so i might not get to work on it until wednesday. i saw someone on gamefaqs wondering about our status or rather if it was still in progress.

[aquagon]

And I won't be translating anything else until I receive the edited scripts for Phase 1 and Jakuri's Lv. 1, given I need to give some attention to the other translations I have on-progress. However, I might change my mind about this once I progress more on the Settei Book translation...

[fetjuel]

I'm getting through Cloche's Level 6. It's pretty long, and I can only work on it in private because the content isn't the kind of thing I'd want anyone seeing over my shoulder. But it's coming along!

So it seems like we have a lot of stuff awaiting editing. Ayulsa? You around?

[Ayulsa]

Mm... I'm being a little laggy on this, unfortunately. Some personal stuff + other projects + more personal stuff have had me lagging, and I think all of our editors are similarly busy so I can't even hand it off to anyone, really. I did manage to do thirty scripts in a day the first day I got them, though, so I can work at speed; I've just been distracted....

[aquagon]

Hmm... maybe then I'll get on continuing with Jakuri's Cosmosphere, since I have already finished with one of the highest priority sections of the Settei Book, and I can get a little side-tracked on it for now.

[fetjuel]

Cloche Cosmosphere Level 6 complete!!

http://metafalica.metalbat.com/fetjuel/ ... el%206.zip

[aquagon]

Cloche Cosmosphere Level 6 complete!!

http://metafalica.metalbat.com/fetjuel/ ... el%206.zip

And I have just finished reviewing, and aside from a small typo on file 582 (and a line to which I added an small comment), the rest is flawless, as expected.

[kWhazit]

Luca's CS Lv1 is essentially complete and ready for review, once I know where to put it and have a few issues that came up resolved. And the issues are:

The Style Guide says to change "Goro to Gengoro: Only if it can be dealt with via a simple dialogue tweak in her introduction- i.e. 'I'm Gengoro, but you can call me Goro.' " That sounds like we're keeping "Goro" everywhere except in the introduction, is this correct?

Is ダイバーズセラピ going to be "Dive Therapy" (as in the NISA translation) or "Diver's Therapy" (the direct transliteration)? This seems like one of those that isn't significant enough to make a fuss over, and "Dive Therapy" sounds fine to me. This should probably be in the style guide.

I saw someone using "stratum" and "persona" to refer to a level of Soulspace and the aspect of personality that appears in it. Are these the standard terms for the retranslation? This should also probably be in the style guide.

And the ugliest one (at least when Luca's all-kanji names are involved): Song magic and tree names. I haven't been able to find any specific reference to this subject.
笑子 deserves to be "Emiko" in my opinion, with an explanation of the meaning when she's introduced:

Code:  [ Select all ]

Luca(0) :22:22:
JP::笑子ちゃんだよっ！<LINE>
私が創ったの！
EN::Ｉｔ’ｓ　Ｓｍｉｌｅｙ　Ｇｉｒｌ！　Ｉ　ｃｒｅａｔｅｄ　ｈｅｒ！
NEW:Ｓｈｅ’ｓ　Ｅｍｉｋｏ，　ｔｈｅ　ｓｍｉｌｉｎｇ　ｇｉｒｌ！　Ｉ　ｍａｄｅ　ｈｅｒ！

雪蛍 is snow + firefly, so "Snow Firefly". Simple enough.

Tree names are worse for Luca, since they're all nonstandard four-kanji compounds that defy concise translation. Two of them came up in Lv1:

隠性妖詩 is particularly hideous to translate, but I'd guess 隠 and 妖 to imply "female" (combining 隠 = hidden with the hidden/dark/female side of the yin/yang concept, and the "alluring" meaning of 妖), and 詩 is the standard kanji for "song" in song magic. 性 doesn't really help since it's a fairly generic "nature/personality/character" kanji. Unless we're keeping the NISA name ("Hidden Enchant"), possibly "Veiled Girlsong" to get some nuance of "hidden", "female", and "alluring"?

氷冷歌弾 (roughly, ice + cold + song + bullet) isn't quite as bad. Maybe something like "Frigid Songblast", again unless we're sticking with NISA's "Chilling Song".

Cloche and Jakuri have it easier, since Cloche's songs are all katakana and nearly English already (except for one combo song), and Jakuri's are mostly the hiragana/katakana/kanji mix that characterizes normal Japanese.

[Deciare]

The Style Guide says to change "Goro to Gengoro: Only if it can be dealt with via a simple dialogue tweak in her introduction- i.e. 'I'm Gengoro, but you can call me Goro.' " That sounds like we're keeping "Goro" everywhere except in the introduction, is this correct?

As far as I can tell, yes.

Is ダイバーズセラピ going to be "Dive Therapy" (as in the NISA translation) or "Diver's Therapy" (the direct transliteration)? This seems like one of those that isn't significant enough to make a fuss over, and "Dive Therapy" sounds fine to me. This should probably be in the style guide.

I would prefer Dive Therapy. I don't think the name of a medical practice usually includes possessive nouns unless you're referring to the practitioner.

I saw someone using "stratum" and "persona" to refer to a level of Soulspace and the aspect of personality that appears in it. Are these the standard terms for the retranslation? This should also probably be in the style guide.

My personal preference leans toward "persona" or "inner self", but I'm not really sure which way is proper... I don't think such terms were used at all in At1, right? So we don't have to worry about remaining consistent with it?

隠性妖詩 is particularly hideous to translate, but I'd guess 隠 and 妖 to imply "female" (combining 隠 = hidden with the hidden/dark/female side of the yin/yang concept, and the "alluring" meaning of 妖), and 詩 is the standard kanji for "song" in song magic. 性 doesn't really help since it's a fairly generic "nature/personality/character" kanji. Unless we're keeping the NISA name ("Hidden Enchant"), possibly "Veiled Girlsong" to get some nuance of "hidden", "female", and "alluring"?

Can we adjust NISA's translation to "Hidden Enchantress" as a compromise? "Enchantress" has been used in literature to refer to alluring females.

[aquagon]

The Style Guide says to change "Goro to Gengoro: Only if it can be dealt with via a simple dialogue tweak in her introduction- i.e. 'I'm Gengoro, but you can call me Goro.' " That sounds like we're keeping "Goro" everywhere except in the introduction, is this correct?

Correct, though I suggested that we used her full name only in dialogues that are extremely serious (like calling a person by a nickname, but calling it by its real name in some situations).

Is ダイバーズセラピ going to be "Dive Therapy" (as in the NISA translation) or "Diver's Therapy" (the direct transliteration)? This seems like one of those that isn't significant enough to make a fuss over, and "Dive Therapy" sounds fine to me. This should probably be in the style guide.

We decided to keep it as Dive Therapy, since isn't necessary to change it.

I saw someone using "stratum" and "persona" to refer to a level of Soulspace and the aspect of personality that appears in it. Are these the standard terms for the retranslation? This should also probably be in the style guide.

Hmm, we really need to come to a decision with it... I think that keeping it as level is okay, but I don't know if "personality" or "persona" are better-

And the ugliest one (at least when Luca's all-kanji names are involved): Song magic and tree names. I haven't been able to find any specific reference to this subject.
笑子 deserves to be "Emiko" in my opinion, with an explanation of the meaning when she's introduced:

Code:  [ Select all ]

Luca(0) :22:22:
JP::笑子ちゃんだよっ！<LINE>
私が創ったの！
EN::Ｉｔ’ｓ　Ｓｍｉｌｅｙ　Ｇｉｒｌ！　Ｉ　ｃｒｅａｔｅｄ　ｈｅｒ！
NEW:Ｓｈｅ’ｓ　Ｅｍｉｋｏ，　ｔｈｅ　ｓｍｉｌｉｎｇ　ｇｉｒｌ！　Ｉ　ｍａｄｅ　ｈｅｒ！

雪蛍 is snow + firefly, so "Snow Firefly". Simple enough.

Tree names are worse for Luca, since they're all nonstandard four-kanji compounds that defy concise translation. Two of them came up in Lv1:

隠性妖詩 is particularly hideous to translate, but I'd guess 隠 and 妖 to imply "female" (combining 隠 = hidden with the hidden/dark/female side of the yin/yang concept, and the "alluring" meaning of 妖), and 詩 is the standard kanji for "song" in song magic. 性 doesn't really help since it's a fairly generic "nature/personality/character" kanji. Unless we're keeping the NISA name ("Hidden Enchant"), possibly "Veiled Girlsong" to get some nuance of "hidden", "female", and "alluring"?

氷冷歌弾 (roughly, ice + cold + song + bullet) isn't quite as bad. Maybe something like "Frigid Songblast", again unless we're sticking with NISA's "Chilling Song".

Cloche and Jakuri have it easier, since Cloche's songs are all katakana and nearly English already (except for one combo song), and Jakuri's are mostly the hiragana/katakana/kanji mix that characterizes normal Japanese.

Other thing we need to decide between all the team, since I'm not sure if we should change all the translations for Luca's songs or just the ones that are too different from their actual meaning or transliteration (such as the change from Byakuya-jou to Lady Momoyo).

[kWhazit]

Here's the link, then! I've left the song tree names in Japanese for now as a reminder to come back to them once a final decision is made.
I find it interesting that Luca does her nervous/guilty "eheheh" laugh almost constantly. She *knows* she's just doing regular Dive Therapy and that Croix has no idea, and seems to feel guilty about it, or at least worried that he'll notice and get upset.

http://metafalica.metalbat.com/kwhazit/LucaCS/LucaCSLv1.rar

EDIT: Just noticed I mistakenly had Lv1A for Snow Firefly thanks to copy/paste from Emiko for the formatting... that needs to be corrected to Lv2 when reviewed or edited.

[fetjuel]

About "persona" and "stratum":

"Personality" seems to describe the amalgam of someone's entire character when dealing with others. But "persona" has the connotation of a role or character being played, as the individual exaggerated identities that live on each level of a Cosmosphere. So, when the script says 人格 or something similarly erudite, I've used "persona". Elsewhere, when the speaker uses the simpler construction like このレベルのクローシェ様, I've used "the Lady Cloche of this level".

I've been using "stratum" for the more technical-sounding 階層, and "level" for the more conversational レベル. There are two different words being used in the original script, reflecting the technical knowledge or speech habits of the characters. So I wanted to keep that in the translation rather than collapsing everything to "level".

I'll add these to the style guide, unless anyone has an objection.

[Kensou77]

http://metafalica.metalbat.com/kwhazit/LucaCS/LucaCSLv1.rar

notes.txt(with gengoro, i'm still more used to the full name... and i am still more liken to the japanese names so in my references it will usually be japanese naming scheme...)

740:
(0):8:8: - i think she is being overly cautious and afraid of chroche.
(156) :27:27: - perhaps shorten the last sentence to [Her favourite!!] by removing "That's" from the sentence might be better?
(0) :30:30 -

742: - i think you have it right her excuse to deter his thoughts from her actual cosmosphere. she's still scared and wants to live "forever" with him in the DT created world after all.. doing her best not to worry about paradigm shifts either.

745: - yup, i agree with your thoughts on 死ぬ思いで. definitely a case of overwork. she's the type to overwork herself anyways. (i think there was a case in at2 where she did actually overwork herself...)

747: - see my note on 742:

748:
(134) :13:13: - i know we are using dive therapy but i still think it should be diver's therapy.. since it is the diver that is receiving the therapy... though i guess dive therapy can still vouch for that definition i guess.. .. <shrug>... it's decided anyways and this one is not that big of a deal..

[aquagon]

Well, I have finished with Jakuri's Lv. 2 Cosmosphere. And here I'm posting the translation for the Settei Book texts that also appear in this cosmosphere level (though they aren't exactly the same, just similar):

宇宙の法則
The Laws of the Universe

宇宙もまた、波動で構成されている。およ
そビックバンと呼ばれる類の「この世界』
の事象は、たった一つの原子核によって
もたらされた。その原子核を『エクサピーコ
(EXA_PICO)』という。エクサピーコが大い
なる意志をもって紡ぎだしたものが『宇宙』だ。

This Universe is made from waves, as well. The event that created [this
world], called the Big Bang, was caused by just an small atomic nucleus.
That atomic nucleus is called [Exa Pico], and by means of its enormous
will, it crafted the [Universe].

宇宙に存在する星や星雲など、すべてはエ
クサピーコから生まれている。この、エクサピ
ーコからの広がりと創造を指して、メタ ファ
ルスの言様で表現すれば『エクサピーコが詩
を紡ぐことで作られています』となる。

The other kind of existences, such as the stars and galaxies, were all born
from Exa Pico, as well. The expansion from Exa Pico and indicating the creation
of every thing has been said metaphorically in Metafalss as [Whenever Exa
Pico crafts a song, it also creates something].

原子核エクサピーコは、無限とも言える数
の波動 (定常波)によって構成されている。そ
してそのうち1つの波動(例えばD波)におい
ても無限とも言える方向に対し、無限とも
言える周波数成分を持っている。

It can be said that the atomic nucleus of Exa Pico also composed an unlimited
number of waves (Static Waves). And thus, each one of these waves (for example:
the D-Waves) can be said in a unlimited number of ways that it also carries
an unlimited number of wave frequencies as its components.

エクサピーコはそういった天文学的な種類
の波動を、時間という概念では計測できない
レベルの短時間で猛烈に放射していく。そし
てその多方向に展開する波同士がぶつかり、
干渉すると、そこで均衡が崩れ波の動き(うね
り)が発生する。それが『導体波』である(図1)。

Exa Pico also emits the astronomical kind of waves at such a rapid and violent
rate that our general concept of time isn't even able of measuring it.
And when the expanding waves come from different directions and bump into
each other, they cause interference to each other, and originate waves that
have lost the equilibrium in their undulation. These new waves are the [Dynamic
Waves] (Pic. 1).

産み出された導体波は、この世界空間を伝播
していき、それがエクサピーコの『宇宙』を
構築。つまり宇宙は、『世界』という概念の
なんで、『エクサピーコが影響を及ぼしている
範囲』と表現することができる。

The newly created Dynamic Waves will propagate through the space of this
world, and create the [Universe] of Exa Pico. In short, we can say that
the Universe, under the general concept of [World], is [an area where Exa
Pico exerts its influence).

こうして広がった導体波は、新たな定常波を
生んでいく。この現象は、エクサピーコが産み
出した導体波が、世界に広がるナム(num)の
海(全波動の振れ幅0、周波数0の空間)に作
用した結果と言える。波動科学的には、ナム
の海に導体D波が振れ幅と周波数を与えたこ
とで、そこに定常波が生まれ、『宇宙』に変化し
て『そこに在り続ける』ことになった...とい
うことになる。(図2)。

Thus, the expanded Dynamic Waves will create a new kind of waves, called
Static Waves. This phenomenon is said to be the result of the Dynamic Waves
created by Exa Pico expanding through the Sea of Num (the space where the
amplitude and frequency of all the waves are zero). The Wave Motion Theory
stipulates that the Dynamic D-Waves gave their frequencies and amplitudes
to the Sea of Num, and that created the Static Waves, turning the [Universe]
into [Something that Continues to Exist]... that it's what is said on it,
at least. (Pic. 2)

この波動の干渉は、特常の波で起こるもの
ではない。導体D波以外の波動も同時に干渉
しているため、そこでは新たな原子核の集合
体を生んでいる。すなわちエクサピーコは、
新たな原子核の集合体を無限に生み続けてい
るといううわけだ。その集合体が星であり、ブラ
ックホールであり、目に見えない波動エネル
ギーである。それらの無数の創造物たちは、
すべてエクサピーコの『詩』によって生まれて
いる。創造物にH波が含まれていることは、
様々の言葉で言うところの『意志』があること
に他ならない。すなわちそれは、エクサピー
コの『想い』なのだ。

This wave interference doesn't happen because of special Static Waves. Except
for the Dynamic D-Waves, all of the waves are the result of a simultaneous
interference, which also produced the assembly of new atomic nucleuses.
We actually could say that the Exa Pico continues creating an unlimited
number of new assembled atomic nucleuses. Among these assemblies we have
the stars, the black holes, and the waves of energy that are invisible to
the naked eye. These countless creations are born from the [Song] of Exa
Pico. The creations also include H-Waves, which, even if they are called
in various ways, they aren't anything more than [Will]. Namely, they are
the [Feelings] of Exa Pico.

*『図1』導体波が導かれるしくみ
[Pic. 1] Derivation of Dynamic Waves

同じ種類の波(例
えばD波同士)が
ぶつかると、波の
干渉によりうねり
が発生する。

When two waves of the same kind (i. e. two identical D Waves) collide with
other, the wave interference causes the creation of a new wave.

*『図2』定常波が誕生するしくみ
[Pic. 2] Formation of the Static Waves

ある一点に一定以上の導体波が集まり、
それが共振現象によって増幅されると、
その場に定常的な力増の定位を創り
出す。それが新たな定常波となる。

Is only in this stationary point where the Dynamic Waves meet, and because
of the resonance phenomenon, they are amplified, creating an static power
exactly where they meet. That power ends turning into a new Static Wave.


(and sorry for not posting this before, but I had connection problems today).

[wizzardx]

Wow, Aquagon, thanks for that translation.

It looks like some pretty abstract stuff, and that's always hard to translate in a way that sounds natural.

Just how many pages do the Settei and Art books have anyway? At this point I'm having visions of you (in your Chroah glasses and casual clothes) slowly working your way through translating a huge set of encyclopedias ^_^.

(Speaking of which, I'm also having the Chroah=Aquagon syndrome. Each time I see pics of him I think of you before I remember the original character. Heh )

[Deciare]

Thank you very much for that translation, aquagon! *loves Wave Theory* It is so nice to know that ar tonelico's design is based on the founding principles for the whole universe. Crafting a song is very much like sharing a desire, an idea, and an intent with creation itself, after all. ^_^

And yes, half the time I see Croix, I do think of aquagon. XD aquagon's scholarly attitude is even more authentic than Croix's.

[aquagon]

Hehe, it's always a pleasure!

Well, the first Settei Book has around 120 pages, while At2's has around 170, so I have yet a lot of translations pending (and I might need some scans from the NISA At1 artbook to make sure if some parts of the World section weren't translated already).

Hahaha, and you both know the reasons behind Chroah and Infel being some of my favorite At characters.