So I decided to play through the Ar Tonelico series

[Ruger10]

I thought I'd give my impression and see what people thought. I'll try to not include spoilers.

Story and music, I liked them. Honestly it seems that most RPG's nowadays want to distance themselves from any romantic element, so it's refreshing to see that relationships play a central role in the story. The visual novel aspect of diving was also an excellent and refreshing choice I saw the series incorporating, and gave me a reason as the player to be interested in the fates of the characters.
I don't need to say much that hasn't been said about music, it kicks ass, very rarely do any non-music based games put a great deal of emphasis on the soundtrack. The fact it plays with the stories and are actually programs helped to give more depth to the world as well. Also these are the only soundtracks I've actually found myself wanting to purchase if that means anything.

Battle system, honestly I considered the battles to not really be the main focus of these games. They were par for the course, though 2 was rather refreshing and dynamic though. The two maiden system that you could evolve spells and use Replakia, Dualstall, and Synchronity Chain were very lively, and the defensive button presses were quite engaging. Game felt a little too easy though.
Also I have to say Croix was one of my favorite male protagonist in the series. He just seemed easier to associate with and was voiced quite well.

I have to say I struggled with 3, it's not that it was difficult... just poorly done. Taking control away from the player doesn't add to the experience, and the gameplay was rather bland and unvaried. I found the worst aspect to be the AI that takes control of the non-leader vanguards, it made the game play disappointing and feel like a chore to push through. Overall the action/rpg hybrid fails compared to it's predecessors. Tales of Vesperia even did a better job at that combat style, a wayyyy better job. And this had Reyvateils to give the combat more depth... What's worse than a bad game is a bad game that had a lot of potential to work with.
While the story is interesting and the diving is ok, I just found myself unhappy with 3 in general. The horrible combat system killed it for me. It's like reading an exceptional book, and every time you want to turn a page someone comes up behind you and shoves a cattle-prod into your back. As good as the book is, after a while you just want to say 'fuckit'. Aoto was also unappealing and cliche as it gets with a main male protagonist, and the english voice acting was awful for him (yes I turned it to the alternative Japanese voicing to save myself). And while skimpy or erotic outfits aren't exactly out of place, having the heroines strip was just a feature I found to be a little over the top considering some of their youthful appearances. If I'm using the slang right, it was 'moe', not a good move Gust.

So 1 was good, I really enjoyed 2, and 3 was... eh... I honestly wish they made some better decisions during the planning phase. Anyone else agree or would does someone have a counter-point to make?

[Usagichan96]

I honestly love 3 much more. Strange I know, but something about the atmosphere and background of Sol Cluster given in the extra content (located in the Settei books) gave me a more majestic appearance than what was sadly the complete opposite in the game. I think everybody agrees that the purging was something that was not able to connect with such a beautiful planet such as Ar Ciel. Just the Third tower's design in itself is exotic and beautifully drawn. I think all the pervy stuff was keeping the game back. Other than that, I enjoyed it.

As for 2, from what I see, it maybe the most favorite game of the series. Everything was done pretty well, with the exception of poor translation in some parts. I would have liked a bigger map of Metafalss to really see the tower, but whatever. As for the battle system, possibly the best of all 3 for me. I extremely enjoyed the interaction the producers created between Luca and Cloche in the Infelsphere. It really fleshed out their characters, however, it can be quite unfair when you have to choose between them.

I think 1 has it's own charm to it, and the atmosphere is quiet relaxing when I play it. Obviously the battle system was pretty basic, but the cosmospheres really made the heroines more amazing. I also enjoyed that I got to finish all 3 cosmosphere's in one playthrough. Just an amazing game overall.

I think you really have to look more into the bonus content like Settei Books (that are translated here) to really get a bigger story on all three regions. That is what made me appreciate each game for it's own theme and uniqueness, while they all combine into one epic plot.

[Ruger10]

I think we agree for the most part, even though I should read more of the backstory you mentioned. I'll look into that though.
I loved the design, story, and atmosphere of 3, those are my favorite things.
But I'd have honestly been happy with a basic turn based system that felt balanced. It's hard to stay upbeat about Qoga when it's just not fun to play, even putting aside the purging feature. I mean they did a good job with the music, art style, and keeping things upbeat, but the controls and combat were just overly simplistic with some sub-par design choices.

So, would you have a recommendation for another game I should try next then after this series? One of those Atelier games possibly?

[Usagichan96]

Yea, I agree, the controls were way too simple, especially for the final game. Sadly, the content in the game, unless you look at the extra terminology after you complete the game, to really get a full view of each region. It's amazing how the producers put so much into Ar Tonelico. History, Religion, Science, Language, and Spiritual beliefs/ morals all are aspects of Ar Ciel. That is how I got to love it even more

As for any other games, I would recommend Mana Khemia: Student Alliance, and Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy. Sadly I have not played many other atelier titles, however I did play Mana Khemia, and LOVED both games. I also played Atelier Rorona, but I had mixed feelings on that game. However, Rorona was the first of the Arland Atelier series so you may want to skip Rorona, and try Totori, since it improves what Rorona has. Just ask around the forum, and there will be people with other suggestions (with much better descriptions than me XD)

[Ruger10]

Funny, I actually just picked up Mana Khemia: Student Alliance on the psp a week ago XD
Thus far, I approve of the game in almost every aspect.
Characters and story have me interested, combat is balanced and fun, and the crafting system is enjoyable and rewarding.
I'm aware the game is originally for the ps2 (and it shows with occasional frame rate problems) but since it's turn based combat it doesn't matter.

Since you've made that recommendation, let me make a couple to return the favor.
If you've got a psp, Ys Seven and Ys: The Oath in Felghana are two games worth a play.
Beyond that I just got back into console gaming, so it will be a while before I'm more versed in RPG games.

Thanks

[Goober]

My only issue with AT1 is the curveball they throw at you at the very, very end if you completed the third reyvateil's "cosmosphere".

AT2 obviously had a lot of problems in the American release, but I was able to look past that. My problem was nearly the exact opposite of AT1. I was already locked into Luca's path by the time the third reyvateil came into play. This was also the first game in the series that I played.

ATQoga is probably my favorite of the series. I just liked Finnel, Saki, Tyria and Aoto more than the main characters in the other games. As you said, combat is not the focus of this series. It got the job done, though towards the end it may have felt grindy with the sudden jump in monster health after you go into the final phase of the game. I believe I needed to use Flipsphere almost every single battle after that point.

[Usagichan96]

Funny, I actually just picked up Mana Khemia: Student Alliance on the psp a week ago XD
Thus far, I approve of the game in almost every aspect.
Characters and story have me interested, combat is balanced and fun, and the crafting system is enjoyable and rewarding.
I'm aware the game is originally for the ps2 (and it shows with occasional frame rate problems) but since it's turn based combat it doesn't matter.

Since you've made that recommendation, let me make a couple to return the favor.
If you've got a psp, Ys Seven and Ys: The Oath in Felghana are two games worth a play.
Beyond that I just got back into console gaming, so it will be a while before I'm more versed in RPG games.

Thanks

I always wanted to pick up Ys. It just seems like an amazing game. Another one I recommend is Jeanne D'arc. I'm glad you are enjoying Mana Khemia! The second game is good, but the first will always have a place in my heart XD

[Downward]

I mostly agree with you, OP. I like At1 but if I were to evaluate it, I'd say it's just "okay". It has a certain charm, a great soundtrack and some good ideas, but it doesn't execute them well and/or bring out their full potential. Also, Lyner. I think it's the most generic of the games, but a good time nonetheless if you can look past its flaws.

The second game is my favorite. It takes the first game's good ideas and (generally) builds on them in good ways. The story is nothing amazing (like the other games'), but it does a good job of engaging the player early on. The setting expands upon the interesting aspects of the first game's, making it feel less generic. The heroines are easily the most interesting in the series (Cloche is the best, come at me Ar tonelibros) (no dont plz) and their greater depth relative to the other games' makes better use of the Cosmosphere and Song Magic concepts. Croix is my favorite of the protagonists as well, though I guess that's not saying much since I can't stand Lyner and found Aoto to be similar to him in some ways (though not as bad). At2's battle system is the best in the series as well, but I also wish it was more difficult or at least had a Hard mode. I could go on, but overall I think At2 has the best of everything in the series save non-Hymnnos music and item synthesis. It's the only game in the series I'd call "good," horrible localization aside.

At3 thoughts, spoiler-tagged just in case:

Spoiler:  [ Open ]

As you can see, I felt the developers had hit their stride with its At2, so I was disappointed to see that the developers dropped many of the things that made it good in making At3. I don't mind the innuendo and such in the games, but I also felt that they went overboard with Purging. I guess its closest equivalent in the other games is the bathing system from At2, but I thought that was more silly than anything and it at least adds something to the game (a different way of leveling and customizing the heroines, more conversations to trigger) whereas Purging is titillation and little else. Honestly though, I doubt it would have bothered me as much if the heroines didn't look so young. I think you said all there is to say about the battle system itself, though. =p

I think At3's heroines were the weakest in the series as well. I guess Tyria is okay, but Saki and Finnel suffer as a result of having to share screentime with their shallow Personas and Saki in particular lacks depth period (I think Sakia Lumei was a little more interesting, even). Speaking of which, one of my big gripes with the first game is that Lyner can max out all of the girls' Cosmospheres, so I was disappointed to see that Aoto can almost do the same thing. Diving is made out to be a deeply intimate thing, so it seems wrong to me that the protagonists can go so far into them before putting a heroine in the friend zone. I thought At2's limit of Level 5 was also a bit high, but it's better than Level 8.

I thought At3 was weak as a finale to the series as well; the game takes forever to get to the point -- revitalizing the planet -- and when it does, the cast of the other games has very little to do with it. I believe the line of thinking regarding this is that if Lyner's group hadn't done X and Croix's hadn't done Y, At3's Z would never have occurred...but I just can't get behind that way of thinking. While it's true, I think the actions of the other game's casts are too far removed from At3 to look at it that way. It's kinda hard to explain what I mean, but I could provide an example if prodded, lol. Anyway, I went when the opening theme medley played during the credits, but at the same time it felt kind of cheap, like the game didn't "earn" that moment. I didn't think, "Wow, I can't believe Ar tonelico is over " the way I did when I finished the last Xenosaga game or what have you.

Sorry if this went on too long/is difficult to read. ^^; I have a little trouble articulating my thoughts sometimes, heh.